I wonder how much time the movie will cover
My wife, who is absolutely obsessed with Pedro Pascal, was just wondering why they covered up his grey hair to the point where he doesn't even have Reed's grey temples.
I'd assumed flashback, but covering a long period of time also makes sense.
I just learned RDJ tried fo Doom in the 2005 movie. Huh.
Byrne's run on the FF still stands as the single-greatest piece of work Marvel's done, imho; with a heavy stress that a comic by a writer/artist is fundamentally a 'truer' comic than one by a writer&artist team; and he grew Sue's personality by leaps and bounds over her 20-odd years of previous characterization. BUT, he didn't do it by making her anything more than the Mom of the team, so I'm not big on making Sue a geneticist or suchnot as it downplays the importance of simply being a good mother. I'm down with feminism's goal of letting women become who they want to be but simply being a good mom isn't a failure so I feel like making her extraordinary beyond her powerset is actually a dis-service to her.
Agree about the Marvels, they didn't do enough with the Monica and Carol relationship (and it's a nit but no one seems to ask how Carol hasn't aged in 25 or 30 years or whatever), but they did too much with Kamala's family.
The intertwined/switching places piece was convoluted when all they needed was for Darr-Ben to figure out the second band had been left on Earth (as was alluded to in the Ms Marvel show) and Carol has to come back to stop her and that's how she got united with Monica and Kamala.
And I am disappointed this didn't resolve the Skrull situation - unclear what Carol has been up to for so long, and that it was essentially disconnected from Secret Invasion hurt both properties. I still think that if The Marvels had happened before Secret Invasion and we could have had Talos get the refugee Skrulls (instead of Valkyrie) and complain to Carol that they can't live on Earth forever, Nick will find out how many there are at some point, they are getting restless, then Secret Invasion as the result of that would have been much better.
Byrne would comment that Sue was very powerful and the most powerful member of the team really. I know they have retconned it, but I had no problem with her crushing on a 19 your old Reed as a 7th grader as nothing suggested that Reed was aware or "groomed" her, especially as they had her interested in Namor for a long time as well so she had her free will to choose.
My memory was faulty though, I thought Sue was working with Reed, like as a grad assistant, at the time of the rocket trip, but I guess that is not the case. Reed was pretty irresponsible all things considered, "Hey, maybe I should bring my girlfriend and her brother along on this experimental flight? Chicks dig space travel!" I think they need to have some reason for her and Johnny to be on board, so think upping her to a contributing team member and not just along for the ride would be a good idea.
From an interview with director Shakman: "The great thing about this is we're building a new universe where there are no other heroes. It's (just) The Fantastic Four."
@fletch awesome. Dark World was when I first realized Thor could be the next Masters of the Universe, as far as a powerful hero with cool friends fighting a variety of monster villains across crazy locations etc. But yeah, space Vikings vs laser elves was right up my alley.
I always thought that it would be cool to have had three Thor movies and each one takes Thor to three of the nine realms. That would have required a lot of planning ahead, though.
Agree about the Marvels, they didn't do enough with the Monica and Carol relationship (and it's a nit but no one seems to ask how Carol hasn't aged in 25 or 30 years or whatever), but they did too much with Kamala's family.
The intertwined/switching places piece was convoluted when all they needed was for Darr-Ben to figure out the second band had been left on Earth (as was alluded to in the Ms Marvel show) and Carol has to come back to stop her and that's how she got united with Monica and Kamala.
And I am disappointed this didn't resolve the Skrull situation - unclear what Carol has been up to for so long, and that it was essentially disconnected from Secret Invasion hurt both properties. I still think that if The Marvels had happened before Secret Invasion and we could have had Talos get the refugee Skrulls (instead of Valkyrie) and complain to Carol that they can't live on Earth forever, Nick will find out how many there are at some point, they are getting restless, then Secret Invasion as the result of that would have been much better.
Dar-Benn's plot to steal resources from all the worlds Carol calls home to restore a world Carol annihilated is actually pretty great. How it got SO convoluted is a good question - in the movie, it almost happens by accident.
Having both Carol and Nick completely fail the Skrulls on Earth could also be an interesting plotline - not really a subplot and what SHOULD have been Secret Invasion. Maybe they have finally found a new home for them, but the Skrulls have adapted to Earth and don't want to go, or the Skrulls decide they hate the humans and decide to destroy the WORLD they never wanted on their way off. Both make more sense than Secret-hey-let's-kill-Maria-and-Talos-for-no-reason!-Invasion. Ugh.
What would have been even better is if the Skrulls were rehomed at some point circa 1999 and were never referenced again.
@yojoebro82 I thought the same thing with the realms. Unexpected part three to be a big tour of the remaining ones. Not that I'm complaining since I enjoyed Ragnarok for what it was.
But Love & Thunder... I enjoyed Marvels more than that. And enjoyed Marvels more than Quantumania, and Multiverse of Madness.
From an interview with director Shakman: "The great thing about this is we're building a new universe where there are no other heroes. It's (just) The Fantastic Four."
I totally get this. I feel like some fan-writers were too caught up in explaining how they fit into the current MCU. It felt like unnecessary baggage. While I'd have no gripe if they just did it in the MCU, I guess an alternate Earth is okay too.
Dar-Benn's plot to steal resources from all the worlds Carol calls home to restore a world Carol annihilated is actually pretty great. How it got SO convoluted is a good question - in the movie, it almost happens by accident.
I totally agree here. I might be a bit thick, but I definitely could've used a more explicit "this is what's happening" because somehow I almost missed it. Still, learning that the villain really is motivated by the hero's significant failure was a great plot turn.
But I believe as a whole, this is a "good on paper" movie. The elements are all there: villain motivation, unique relationship between the main characters, creative action sequences, a Cats musical number...
But it doesn't actually register while I'm watching it. Like, they told me Monica had abandonment issues with Carol, but I didn't believe it. Swapping places during fights should've been bonkers, but I couldn't really follow it on the screen.
@yojoebro82 I thought the same thing with the realms. Unexpected part three to be a big tour of the remaining ones. Not that I'm complaining since I enjoyed Ragnarok for what it was.
But Love & Thunder... I enjoyed Marvels more than that. And enjoyed Marvels more than Quantumania, and Multiverse of Madness.
I'm still bitter about the Warriors Three being nothing but cannon fodder (2/3 of whom were killed off so willy-nilly that it was insulting) but despite that, there's SOME redeemable quality to it. Still, Ragnarok needed to be a one-off. Like in the old days when comics wrapped up a big story line then did a light-hearted filler issue with a guest artist and writer before going into the next story. That's what Ragnarok needed to be.
Love and Thunder was crap, I'm sorry. My personal choice for worst MCU movie (though I have not seen Quantummania, or Marvels, and fell asleep during Wakanda Forever). Tika overstayed his welcome.
My feeling is Quantumania is worse. Love and Thunder I will likely give a second chance one day, Quantumania I will not. I haven't rewatched MOM either though. Black Widow, Eternals, Shang Chi, and of course Guardians 3 and No Way Home I have.
When I said "unexpected part three" above, I meant "I expected", damnit. 🙂
I think most of Phase 4 and 5 films have been good on paper - the idea of the D+ shows feeding into the films and adding depth to characters, the overall idea of being postscripts to the Thanos epic, each film introducing the next generation, and the multiverse as the connecting tissue to allow for some fun storytelling - it all works in theory.
But a few too many times the execution has been off - I think the scripts have consistently been a little undercooked, I think they simultaneously strayed from the MCU formula to try something different at times but then undercut that by too often reverting to the same big battle ending (Wandavison is exhibit A where to me the finale was off, while Loki showed how you don't need the big fight and can do something different).
And the threads and hints are reaching late 80's Claremont X-Men plotting where we see someone in a panel foreshadowing something and then 2 years later we get back to them - it needs to tighten up. (I do give them some slack as they had the pandemic, the Majors legal stuff, etc. that clearly threw wrenches into things)
Love & Thunder is the low point of the MCU movies for me. Secret Invasion is the low point of the entire MCU. What a mess.
The Marvels and Quantumania were fine, just nothing special. They're around a 6/10 ranking for me. Love & Thunder is 5/10 and Secret Invasion is a 4/10.
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