Street Humans

It really isn't looking good. Either thematically or physically. The figures look.. fine. I'm not going to say they look bad. But they certainly don't look -good- either. But I think part of that 'they just look fine' comes from what they are as much as it comes from how they're designed; who cares about these? Based on the failure of the first campaign - not very many people. I mean, that first KS did -abysmal- numbers. It didn't just fail a little bit. It failed HARD.

I feel like Old Rusky didn't really do anything to update these from the last KS to address why they might not have appealed to people. It's just like 'I'm going to keep trying until it funds.' Which, hey, that might work. But there's also the possibility that it won't work to keep trying to sell people a product they VERY loudly said they didn't want the first time. Making the construction more modular, I think, just doesn't address the actual problem.

If I'm just going to look at this objectively, and ignore that I think the creator is an absolute twat, it's still a giant nothing sandwich. Biggest problem right off the bat is that the figures are too damn big. Even if I wanted random civilians for my shelves, which I do not, who are these supposed to be compatible with? Do the majority of collectors that he's targeting actually want thugs and passersby that are taller than Captain America? They're marketed as 1:12 scale, but if they're meant to be normal people... they're more like 1:10 scale maybe? Marvel Legends is pretty much the largest 1:12 line out there, so if these are too big for that line, they're essentially too big for every 1:12 line that exists.

Either way, none of those comparison photos paint a flattering picture of who you might want to display these with. And is anyone collecting this line just to collect the line and have them by themselves on the shelf? Not only do I not think that's the case, I don't think that's even how Ruskerooni is marketing them. They're CLEARLY a 'put this with your Marvel Legends' product... that doesn't scale with Marvel Legends. Big win there, huh?

Also, I get that these are supposed to be like... urban?.. or whatever. But that dainty little bit of underwear sticking out of their pants is fucking stupid AND further limits their usefulness to basically representing only a very specific type of person.

So what is this line? Who is it supposed to be appealing to? People that want civilians or thugs bigger than their Captain America figures? And how many people that even are interested will buy multiples? As I recall, the last KS had less than 300 backers and spent a lot of time with that needle not moving at all, and the average pledge was less than 200 dollars. So unless something drastically changes here, with those same numbers he's going to still fail to hit the min. funding goal. By a fair bit.

I'm not rooting for this to fail. At all. I don't personally care about these figures. I would not display them even if they were given to me for free. But if people want them, I hope they get made. I just see there being a big mountain to climb here to make that happen, and I don't agree that they look even remotely good enough to make that climb any easier than it was the first time around.

@theknightdamien Do you think most of the collectors who might be interested in having street thugs to display/perform toy photography are going to be displaying them with Captain America? My guess is most would be displaying them with Batman, Spider-Man, Daredevil, etc. And everyone of those characters has gone up against random thugs who are bigger than them.

I don't have a problem with the size of the first wave of figures in the series being this size, assuming future waves - if there are any - feature some variety in size of body so you can build out a gang with a diversity of body types and sizes.

I backed 2 of these. Let me say that I'm not a particularly big fan of Shartimus, though I also have no hate for him. I don't find him offensive, I just think he's extremely annoying to listen to in any format other than his simple review videos, given the fact the dude has some tremendous difficulty expressing himself and a poor command of the English language.

But I backed it because I think the figures actually look pretty decent, and I wouldn't mind having some random thugs to pose my street-level heroes with. They're not blowing me away, but I think the proportions are solid, the sculpts and details are nice. I like his planned add-on accessory packs, too...mostly.

That said, I'm not overly confident that this will fund, but for different reasons. I think the name is horrible, and I don't think anyone gives a damn about the alien interchangeable parts. That is such a waste, and that money would have been better spent on other accessories that help give people even more options to army build.

But mostly, I'm not sure the demand is great enough for random street thug army builders as the basis for an entire line. Personally, I'm down for a handful of generic street thugs. But after 4 or 5, I think I'm good. I don't think more than a handful of people will be down to army build these in huge numbers. Maybe customizers.

That said, Unparalleled Universe's sasquatch guy funded (I like UU a lot more than I like Shartimus, but I could not bring myself to back his figure; I have absolutely no need or interest in it). I can't imagine anyone really wanted that beyond the most hardcore UU viewers, but it funded because the whole community helped him promote it and a lot of people in the community just like the guy. Maybe the same thing will happen for SP. He does, after all, have even more subscribers than UU.

@marvellegendsman It's weirdly and unhelpfully pedantic to argue about which specific 6-foot+ superhero character people are going to display these with. I would hazard to say that most people displaying these as thugs/villains (which is probably most people buying them) are less interested in thugs that are the equivalent of 6'5-7' tall and stand taller than the big, tall hero characters. I'd say most people want their thugs and the like to be average looking when fighting the hero. Whether that be Moon Knight, or Punisher, or Captain America, or whatever. Even if you go with a shorter hero character like a Spider-Man, the reality is that these figures are still too tall to represent an average human being.
But really, if you're fine with an army of near-7-foot thugs, there's several lines of wrestling figures that will give you that for 20 bucks each or less.
So, again, who are these appealing to? No matter how you slice it, these are too tall for all your actual 1:12 figures. I doubt they're going to look all that good with your 1:10 figures. And if you don't mind them being too big.. there's cheaper options with way more variety. So what's the real life appeal of these beyond people that want to support Rusky making toys of an idealized version of himself?

What we definitely agree on is the limited appeal of a line like this. As I said - last time he did this he didn't even come remotely close to funding and he's 're-launching' with... basically the same product, right? So what did he change that makes him think NOW people are going to be like 100 thousand dollars more interested than they were last time? To my mind, some cosmetic changes or some functionality changes aren't going to get him there because that wasn't likely the core of his problem the first time. It was that no one (read: not enough people) wants these. Toy collectors love to bang on about wanting civilians and world building and vehicles and dios, but the reality is that most of them glue their wallets shut whenever any of those things are actually being offered.

Honestly, army building isn't realistic when figures are 30 bucks each, won't be on clearance/sale, and have to be ordered online with shipping costs attached. And customizers are notoriously cheap when it comes to fodder for obvious reasons. Not always, of course. But usually I don't see people buying custom fodder for full price if they can avoid it. And again, I'm not sure what these really offer for customizing fodder that you can't get from much cheaper wrestling figures and the like.

So yeah. I'm not wishing ill on anyone despite my personal feelings. Plus, David Vonner is involved in this and I have a ton of respect for Vonner. I just don't see this as a winning idea or a winning execution of the idea, and if it does skate through it'll be just because he keeps putting it back up. Valaverse failed the first time too, and he went on to crank out broken, cheaply-made figures with unoriginal designs. Why can't Rus, right?

I've always thought the interest for civilian figures was over-exaggerated, and I don't think they'd sell well if offered.  And the previous Street Humans KS failure (and this one's likely failure) will be a sort of testament to that idea.

There are a number of issues with this campaign.  The figures are a little large like KD said.  The alien aspect has never been interesting and seems tacked on so these aren't just civilians.  The name is terrible.  The funding limit is high, especially when it's only unlocking two figures which are essentially the same with just different deco/head/weapon.   There should probably be at least another colorway or two for that amount of funding money.  And then of course, there's also Shartimus himself, who is obviously a divisive personality. 

Personally, I'm not even sure how much of a factor Shartimus will be in the campaign's success/failure.  I think the product itself is just boring.  One of the two funding figures could have come with a jacket, so you could swap around the two figures to create more variety.  As well, each figure should have had an alternate head with a different profile instead of just an expression.  Having both heads be the same character limits any desire to buy multiples of that figure.  Ultimately, like KD says, the price is going to be too high for civilian figures.  And the lack of built-in, right off the start, variety kills the line.

Well, I came for little feedback on Street Humans and found both more and less than I bargained for. My first question of whether there was any interest here at The Fwoosh in this KS has been answered resoundingly given I’m one of five entrants on the page (maybe there are more lurking). I’m no fan of Shartimus, but I’ve also no enmity for him and I would like to see this KS fund as I’m confident I’m going to back it in some capacity. I think the designs are pretty good for what they are: non-descript thugs that won’t outshine the MLs I plan to use them with; Tombstone needs some punks and these might be the droids for whom I’d been searching.

Not to derail, but I’d hoped that The Fwoosh would follow up AI with a line of thugs of different backgrounds. It’s my opinion that there is a market for this, and I think we need look no further than how many times Hasbro has released the ‘suited body’ mold even expanding to include three body types now (original, MCU Logan from the two pack, and MCU Happy). MLs have a host of already released crime bosses and heroes that scream for disposable miscreants at their side not to mention the fact that my needs have grown beyond what’s available from Hasbro.

So, yeah, Street Humans is on my radar, but, as mentioned in another post, the alien heads are as comical as they are useless….replace them with more portraits and vary the styles of dress a bit.

I think these look decent. not a fan of shartimus but these are pretty good. great for army building, i really like the vampire head, that was the deal maker for me. these follow in the same"thug"path as Vapor(mezco), City Thugs (take that toys), Hoodz(mezco) and so on. Heck, good for kitbashing also. 6.5" is a good height for these.

Some people online seem to be angry at him for doing this.  I'm not mad at him for trying.  I hope this gets funded and people like them.

But these aren't for me.  I only collect things I have nostalgia for.  And I have limited shelf space (and money).  Not willing to waste either on characters I have no attachment to.

I think the Odious funded because people like Wade at Unparalleled Universe.  Shartimus is the biggest toy reviewer, but I think that's because he's been doing it the longest, I don't think people enjoy his personality as much.  And Wade interacts with the community much more, I think people were willing to back his kick-starter even if they didn't really want the figure just to support him.  I'm not sure if Shartimus has the same popularity with the toy community, despite being the biggest YouTube reviewer.  

And as a long time collector, I don't really watch reviews anymore.  What's a review going to tell me?  I can usually tell what the articulation on a figure will be just by looking at some pictures of it.  And QC issues vary, so just because the reviewer has good or bad paint apps doesn't mean the figure I get will have the same paint.  So the toy YouTubers I watch are the ones posting news like the Fwoosh weekly, or livestreams like Unparalleled Universe or Displaying Model Behavior where we can interact with the community more.  Dave at Model Behavior has said his review videos get lower views, I think it's because other long-time collectors have similar viewing habits as I do.  So someone like Shartimus who primarily does reviews and not much else is losing popularity. 

Still trying to really hone in on an understanding on what a "Street Human" really is, myself...

Posted by: @thebluemarvel

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non-descript thugs that won’t outshine the MLs I plan to use them with; Tombstone needs some punks and these might be the droids for whom I’d been searching.

It’s my opinion that there is a market for this, and I think we need look no further than how many times Hasbro has released the ‘suited body’ mold even expanding to include three body types now (original, MCU Logan from the two pack, and MCU Happy). MLs have a host of already released crime bosses and heroes that scream for disposable miscreants at their side not to mention the fact that my needs have grown beyond what’s available from Hasbro.

Snipped out the portions relevant to my response.

First of all, I don't think these are going to look all that good with Tombstone because they're not going to allow Tombstone to look big and imposing. For that, you really do need some 'regular size' guys. And if you are just looking for 7 footers to hang out with Tombstone, again I've gotta direct you to the clearance wrestling figure aisle. Sometimes you can find jeans and t-shirt guys for as low as 5-10 dollars. So again, it feels like any support for this line is more a desire to support this line (which is TOTALLY fine and good) rather than because this product is necessary.

As for the demand/market for this; I think the conversation about Marvel Legends doing it is way more nuanced than you're allowing for. First all, Hasbro doesn't depend on the sales of suited figures to prop up their entire brand, which is the exact opposite of what Street Humans is expecting to do. Those figures in ML are add-ons, ancillary figures. Moreover, 90% or more of them are named characters. And that's very important because Marvel is an absolute juggernaut (har har) right now. People want to buy all the characters - including the ones that just wear suits or plain clothes. But that shouldn't be taken to mean there's intense interest from 1:12 collectors in nameless civilians. Even the unnamed 'plain clothes' type bad guys we've gotten are thematically connected to a major villain (like the suited baddie that came with the Gameverse Mr. Negative and was directly based on a video game appearance of that thug, rather than being 'random').

That's all to say that I just don't think the success of Hasbro producing plain clothes characters in Marvel Legends is indicative of fans being willing to just buy random dudes in regular clothes. Take my above example; it was a 'random thug' packed with a main villain - both based on their appearance in one of the most popular video games to come out that year. Hardly comparable to a nameless dude in hoodie.

I've said lots of times that I love seeing all the smaller creators in this space. It's only made toy collecting better and more fun. But I also think it serves to be realistic about these projects and what they offer. Both to temper expectations and to present the feedback necessary to change course if things don't go well. I feel like a lot of what's being said now was said last time and Shartimus basically ignored it all in favor of just upgrading the bodies a little bit and hoping that's enough. Given he's still almost 100k away from his goal and is currently running his campaign at the same time as Cyberzoic... I think he has a serious uphill battle that might not have been as bad if he'd considered stuff beyond the design of the base bodies.

Relaunching the kickstarter now of all time seems like a really poor move if he actually wants this to get funded.

There are two other action figure kickstarters up right now, those being Beasts of the Cyberzoic, which has been anticipated for awhile now and has a dedicated following thanks to the creator main line.

The other is Legendari, another 1/12 action figure line, and though that took awhile to get backed ot still has a sizeable packing due to the Horsemen doing the sculpting.

Both these campaigns end this month or at the start of next month, so some people already have their money focused somewhere else (I'm sure there is a decent overlap between the backers as BotM has appeared at several shows 4H also frequent).

Additionally you have the Giant Man Haslab, and ignoring the debate if it will or will not get backed, that's another thing stealing away people's attention and budget.

And amongst all that you also have the fact that it is getting closer to Christmas, a lot of people are already planning a head and setting aside money for December.

So it really seems like poor planning to launch thus now rather than sometime later next year (and this isn't even mentioning smaller things like the 4H launching a new Reinforcement wave or other pre-orders coming into stock).

I really wonder, and I'm not saying this is my opinion on the guy...

...but how much of it is who created it. 

Russ is very polarizing in the community due to his personality. He is every worst trope and stereotype of what people think toy nerds are, and to some, his shtick/persona are grating. We're talking about the guy that D_Amazing tried to fight at Toy Fair, for Christ's sake...but that's a completely different conversation for another day. 

But it does make me wonder if someone sees his name attached to a project, and they say "Nah, F that guy".

This is not to open the floodgates on a Russ bashing session. I think he seems like a nice enough guy, but I get why he's not some's cup of tea (but ask me my opinions on that Grim guy and you'll get both barrels). He's like the Bobcat Goldthwait of toy reviewers. Just conjecture on my part for the multitude of reasons as to why it could be that this is failing. 

@blankslate

In the before Fwoosh, we had a thread that got locked that was pretty much to that effect.

@theknightdamien

I couldn't agree more. Mooks were my main interest in the line, but the scale feels like it misses 2/3 the major lines one might want modern street mooks for! They probably work fine with DC Multiverse, but have much more limited usage for Marvel Legends or G.I. Joe Classified. And yeah, if you want bigger mooks, street clothes WWE basics are the way. Mattel's got the improved articulation on the basics and, just for one example, they just released a figure of the recently-released-from-WWE Top Dolla. The pegs are gonna be full of that dude, and he's in pretty comparable clothing to this line. Toss a fabric hoodie on him from one of those toy clothes sites and you're probably still coming out ahead on the budget.

I personally don't see any appeal in this line. It's borrowing a lot of the design choices I don't like from Marvel Legends, but delivering it in a more expensive and unrecognizable format. Count me among those who isn't a fan of the producer (I could never get past the handle) so I don't have that going for me. This seems like something that should only interest the fans of his brand, but it's not like he has some character associated with said brand that his fans might want a figure of. I hope it funds, as I'm sure this would be a dream come true for the guy, but I don't see it happening.

Posted by: @theknightdamien

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Snipped out the portions relevant to my response.

First of all, I don't think these are going to look all that good with Tombstone because they're not going to allow Tombstone to look big and imposing. For that, you really do need some 'regular size' guys. And if you are just looking for 7 footers to hang out with Tombstone, again I've gotta direct you to the clearance wrestling figure aisle. Sometimes you can find jeans and t-shirt guys for as low as 5-10 dollars. So again, it feels like any support for this line is more a desire to support this line (which is TOTALLY fine and good) rather than because this product is necessary.

As for the demand/market for this; I think the conversation about Marvel Legends doing it is way more nuanced than you're allowing for. First all, Hasbro doesn't depend on the sales of suited figures to prop up their entire brand, which is the exact opposite of what Street Humans is expecting to do. Those figures in ML are add-ons, ancillary figures. Moreover, 90% or more of them are named characters. And that's very important because Marvel is an absolute juggernaut (har har) right now. People want to buy all the characters - including the ones that just wear suits or plain clothes. But that shouldn't be taken to mean there's intense interest from 1:12 collectors in nameless civilians. Even the unnamed 'plain clothes' type bad guys we've gotten are thematically connected to a major villain (like the suited baddie that came with the Gameverse Mr. Negative and was directly based on a video game appearance of that thug, rather than being 'random').

That's all to say that I just don't think the success of Hasbro producing plain clothes characters in Marvel Legends is indicative of fans being willing to just buy random dudes in regular clothes. Take my above example; it was a 'random thug' packed with a main villain - both based on their appearance in one of the most popular video games to come out that year. Hardly comparable to a nameless dude in hoodie.

I've said lots of times that I love seeing all the smaller creators in this space. It's only made toy collecting better and more fun. But I also think it serves to be realistic about these projects and what they offer. Both to temper expectations and to present the feedback necessary to change course if things don't go well. I feel like a lot of what's being said now was said last time and Shartimus basically ignored it all in favor of just upgrading the bodies a little bit and hoping that's enough. Given he's still almost 100k away from his goal and is currently running his campaign at the same time as Cyberzoic... I think he has a serious uphill battle that might not have been as bad if he'd considered stuff beyond the design of the base bodies.

 

You may be overthinking/analyzing my response and, possibly, this Kickstarter. I’m not going to get into a long and protracted rebuttal because my investment in the topic, admittedly, is not where yours seems to be. Suffice it to say, I take pictures of my figs, but don’t display them. I buy every suited (or civilian dressed) fig with the intention of repurposing them as thugs and miscreants. I’m not alone in this dynamic and Hasbro is aware of these tendencies, in my opinion, and has found creative ways to deliver with profit as the incentive. So, I’m not surprised or confused as to why Shartimus went this route and can see myself backing for at least 2-4 of these with an accessory pack for variety.

Quick one-offs:

Thugs/guards/muscle/security are often large humans and bigger than even the outsized personalities they protect - there’s no rubric that they be a certain height.  

Those wrestler figs do not work for me as the proportions are often comical (pun intended).

And, the elephant in the room (not necessarily this one) is that many collectors seem to be irritated by Shartimus (whatever the reason), but I only care about the figs (as with any manufacturer) separating out the personalities behind them.

I’m good with my choice to support and those of others not to.