I think The Marvels took a lot of the hit that the accumulated badwill from Quantumania and (sorry RU) Eternals and (sorry me) Thor 4 and some of the D+ shows had generated.
I also feel that, like the first Ant-Man films, the first Captain Marvel film was bolstered by the MCU being so hot, and Disney misinterpreted that success as interest in those characters on their own. (I'll add Dr Strange in there as well, to a lesser extent).
They need to humanize Carol more. This film helped some with that, but they missed (to me) a big chance for Carol to really talk with Monica about that relationship and what she has been dealing with since she had her powers unlocked and remembered some of her past. They did not do enough with the idea that Carol didn't really think about how her absence impacted Lt Trouble, and I think they needed to talk a bit more about the burden she felt she had to fix the Kree (which backfired) and to save the Skrulls (not going well) and that she feels like a failure despite her powers? They dance around the idea of the expectations on her from all over, with Kamala realizing that Captain Marvel can't always save everyone, and Monica being disappointed with her - to me that was lost potential for Carol to admit that she was thrown into this world, doesn't know who she is really, and is lonely yet powerful. She's like Superman without the normal life to ground her. She's also like 60 years old now - what's that about? Talk about with great power comes great responsibility - so much they could explore with her over the last 30 years...
Eventually writers and producers are going to let something slip through the cracks... willingly for the purposes of being able to tell the story the want to tell without being beholden to one, two, or three other storylines.
That is what I had always assumed during the early days of the MCU. They really focused on the project at hand and did the connections they could but if it contradicted something from a previous movie, oh well. The credit scenes always stick out to me since some of them were just 'really cool' teases for what's to come even though some didn't fit plotwise with what eventually came. but yeah, when things are so heavily connected, it's gonna be tough to make it completely fit without having one person rigidly running all of it, and even then that person is gonna need one HELLUVA excel sheet to keep track of it all. Do they have a department as MS that's basically a breathing wiki? Can I head that up?
Then I see Bob Iger say things like, "I think we needed more executives on hand to make sure things were being done correctly". No, no that is the exact wrong lesson being learned. I think more than anything this movie was a victim of franchise fatigue. It is a very real thing.
Everytime a movie is less successful than I feel it deserves, I'm concerned the producers will walk away learning the wrong lesson. So this is exactly a case of that. Ugh.
I think The Marvels took a lot of the hit that the accumulated badwill from Quantumania and (sorry RU) Eternals and (sorry me) Thor 4 and some of the D+ shows had generated.
heh, no worries. I know what happened with Eternals, and can't blame people for sneering at something they weren't interested in. But yeah, I feel like it isn't too much to compare Marvels to Solo, a movie that did poorly because of how people felt about the last release in the franchise.
I also feel that, like the first Ant-Man films, the first Captain Marvel film was bolstered by the MCU being so hot, and Disney misinterpreted that success as interest in those characters on their own. (I'll add Dr Strange in there as well, to a lesser extent).
Sure. I enjoyed the first Captain Marvel but am still a little surprised it made as much as it did. but yeah, everything was a billion dollar project at the time.
They need to humanize Carol more. This film helped some with that, but they missed (to me) a big chance for Carol to really talk with Monica about that relationship and what she has been dealing with since she had her powers unlocked and remembered some of her past. They did not do enough with the idea that Carol didn't really think about how her absence impacted Lt Trouble, and I think they needed to talk a bit more about the burden she felt she had to fix the Kree (which backfired) and to save the Skrulls (not going well) and that she feels like a failure despite her powers? They dance around the idea of the expectations on her from all over, with Kamala realizing that Captain Marvel can't always save everyone, and Monica being disappointed with her - to me that was lost potential for Carol to admit that she was thrown into this world, doesn't know who she is really, and is lonely yet powerful. She's like Superman without the normal life to ground her. She's also like 60 years old now - what's that about? Talk about with great power comes great responsibility - so much they could explore with her over the last 30 years...
I don't know at all, but I wouldn't be surprised to learn a lot of character moments are what was edited out to get the trim runtime.
Just to make things easier on all of us: Every character from every Marvel movie ever has now been rumored to be appearing in Deadpool 3, correct?
Eyes of Wakanda is a new animated series coming next year.
“Throughout Wakandan history, brave warriors have been tasked to travel the world retrieving dangerous vibranium artifacts. This is their story.”
This is definitely a poster.
Freshman Year is now titled Friendly Neighborhood Spider-Man.
They're saying X-Men 97 will have cel-shaded animated like What If but with a filter to mimic the original cartoon's look.
Rumor is that Iron Heart is going to be reworked and is off the schedule for now.
I personally felt Iron Heart was maybe one step too far in the "young female replacement" model the MCU has been using given she had no personal connection to Tony to have a torch passing moment. Riri builds tech that a genius with a billionaire's resources was barely able to do, doesn't really know Tony or any armor person (in the MCU - in the comics, you have Tony still alive and they can interact). They could rectify this if she gets mentored by Rhodey or Pepper along the way.
But contrast that to the others - Kate works with Clint, he trains her; Yelena is Natasha's family, wants to take up her mantle; Jen gets Bruce's blood, he helps her deal with it; Shuri takes over for T'CHalla, bloodline; Cassie is Scott and Hope's daughter. Four relatives and a direct mentoring thing so it all works. Riri in contrast has seemed to be the most forced into a "replacement" role to have an armored character.
@ru1977 I am amazed that Sony has managed to milk the Spiderverse as much as they have without Spidey, but I can't see this being too popular - maybe it will surprise me.
Is there a live-action Spider-Gwen planned? That seems like it should be happening, unless Marvel/Disney is trying to keep her and Miles for the main MCU.
@fac I get that thinking with Ironheart but I also don't see a need for the 'replacement' to have direct contact or lineage with the original. Kamala was firmly in her hero persona before actually coming in contact with Carol and Monica but I don't think that hurt any. If anything, the ones who do it entirely on their own without the mentoring earned it even more. It at least makes them more unique, and may even make it easier for them to stand out on their own in the public's view. Sam is always going to be compared to Steve but Riri doing her thing more independently may be an advantage.
Is it reworked into a movie or they're doing like Born Again with it?
@fac I feel the same way with the Sonyverse. I'm always open to them, as much as some of their ideas never would have occurred to me to do as a standalone projects, like Morbius and Kraven. But I get why they're doing it (creatively I mean, financially is obvious) because... yeah, they can be interesting characters and something good can actually be done with these stories. I still haven't watched Morbius but I could see how that plot could be entertaining. Which clearly doesn't matter since I haven't watched the damn thing.
And Madame Web, on its face... could be good. The trailer made me think they wanna appeal more to younger ladies and maybe that'll work. I feel like the lead is the weakest performer though and that poster is... I mean... it's definitely got some webs and madames on it so no false advertising at least. But it also tells me nothing about the movie, no entertainment expectations set up. I guess the ladies wear their superhero heads as hats? I dunno. But I've been down on posters being just faces since the 90s damnit. I remember seeing the poster for Green Mile and wondering if Tom Hanks was a bus driver or what. Then there's all the Tom Cruise movies you gotta guess what they're about because it's just another picture of him smiling. Or the Dimension films with a bunch of floating heads with a blue filter to show it's horror.
Anyway, I've heard nothing about Gwen and that's kinda surprising. Maybe everyone is waiting for the animated movies to wrap up before she and Miles show up in live action?
@ru1977 I wasn't considering Kamala or America as they have their own power sets and are not replacing a character/power set in the MCU - so I was focused on "Established Hero, Verion 2" characters - both Tony and Steve already had heir apparents in Rhodey and Sam lined up, Riri just seems extra?
It's just the problem with mimicking unique, powerful characters - where would another unique, powerful character come from that mimics the first? Granted, the armor makes this the powerful character aspect most accessible to someone random.
Not a big issue really, just more of an observation that the character seemed to exist without a great reason, at least to me, in an already crowded MCU.
I think it is to be reworked like DD? It has been pushed back to fall of 2025.
@ru1977 I wasn't considering Kamala or America as they have their own power sets and are not replacing a character/power set in the MCU - so I was focused on "Established Hero, Verion 2" characters - both Tony and Steve already had heir apparents in Rhodey and Sam lined up, Riri just seems extra?
Which is kinda funny since Rhodey seemed extra 12 years ago, but he was always the armored hero for the Public Sector while Tony was the Private Sector. I believe that's how Cheadle put it years ago anyway, and now Riri is Private Sector as well.
Not a big issue really, just more of an observation that the character seemed to exist without a great reason, at least to me, in an already crowded MCU.
And I think it's crowded only because we have so few projects per year. I know that seems counterintuitive with the superhero fatigue and 'too many projects' etc, but I still feel if we were getting better quality, it would be more successful.
If we got something along the lines of Iron Man 3, Dark World, Winter Soldier, and Guardians of the Galaxy all in one year, then Age of Ultron, Ant-Man, Civil War, and Doctor Strange the following year... would people be upset? Some, maybe, would feel it was too much at once, but I think a lot of people would have been frothing for it. If the movies are as good as those were. In one year you get an okay sequel with a beloved character, an entertaining stinker, an intensely loved sequel that surpassed the original, and a surprisingly fun and new set of characters.
So, if you compressed these release dates so that some of these characters don't have several years between appearances, or something like Young Avengers doesn't finally culminate when the cast is middle aged Avengers, it might be a better system. People might not sneer at all these new projects featuring characters 'nobody asked for' as much if they're favorite character(s) are still getting featured every year or two as well. And we can move these large, overarching plots along a little faster. I know the Infinity Saga was a slow burn but that was then, and there was only one big plot that was ongoing, here we have several strands and it's time to wrap them up. One at a time, but you can't have so many dangling, just ask George RR Martin.
Higher further faster, baby.
I think it is to be reworked like DD? It has been pushed back to fall of 2025.
Man, wasn't it already pushed back? This is the age of delays though.
New What If trailer.
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