We continue our conversation with Horsemen "Cornboy" Mayse and Chris Dahlberg literally from the floor of the 2007 San Diego Comic Con. In this installment we further our discussion about the newly announced DC Universe Classics line from Mattel.
Read on to get the scoop on the Horsemen’s thoughts about the technical side of making actions figures, as well as a successful formula for a collector-driven line.
Fwooshnet: So, a lot of fans are deeply interested in character selection and the "completing of teams" aspect of DCUC. Groupings like the JLA, JSA, JLI and Teen Titans are all groups that have a lot of interest. Do you think it is important to fill out the teams as the line goes further and further?
CB: Yeah, absolutely. I said it in the panel but one of our ideas was to have specific waves. In this instance, what we were referring to as "tent pole" characters, a character like a Superman, a Batman a Wonder Woman, Green Lantern and Flash, you know- your really big characters, there has to be at least one of them in each assortment to carry the line. Then, with that tent pole character you need some other corresponding character, whether it be a villain or a secondary character. Like if it were, for example, a Batman, then you would have a Robin or Nightwing, some one like that. Then maybe an obscure character or two then a build-a-figure that also corresponds to the characters in the assortment in some way or another. That is how we are trying to set up the waves. It’s not always going to work out that way but we are also looking toward the future. Like right now, we actually have five waves completely planned out and there are characters throughout waves four and five that correspond all the way back to wave one. Now, we wont be able to do like, say it is the Legion of Superheroes, or Teen Titans or anybody from the JSA, we won’t be able to get all of those characters into one calendar year but we will try to fit two or three. But then, over the course of three or four years you are going to be able to have like, a whole Justice League or a whole wave of JSA or something like that. Also, one thing that I suggested today, and people were coming up in the panel suggesting the Legion and Teen Titans and JSA, and I think it would be spectacular to do a Target or Toys R Us exclusive six-pack of something like just the Teen Titans or just the Legion of Superheroes. It would be a great way to get those out there.
Fwooshnet: That would be very cool indeed. As we were talking about looking down the road with certain characters, how about from a sculptural or design perspective are you working on specific base bodies that that would fill uses for many different characters? Like maybe a mid-sized body that could be used with a current character but then could be used down the road for another or several other figures of characters with similar builds?
CB: That is actually very much in line with what we are doing right now. I’ll let Chris explain that a little bit.
CD: A lot of what we are working with right now helps with a process of putting together other characters. I don’t want to say piecemeal but at least with the articulation points you can move these around and reuse these and then place other part and pieces with them to specifically suit the character.
CB: And this another one of the ways to make this line far more palletable to Mattel. Figures like these can be pretty expensive to produce so one of the things we were able to do to convince Mattel to do a line like this and go in for the whole DC Universe is to take certain parts of the body and reuse parts. It really is very similar to Marvel Legends in that regard. We are hoping that we are going to be more efficient though and over the course of a couple of years we’re going to have a pretty huge selection of body types and parts that we can intermingle and mix and match and create characters by putting certain pieces here and there and sculpting over parts thus creating a line that could be very expensive a lot more cost effective and encourages Mattel to keep the line going.
CD: For the most part, the heroes are primarily men in tights and suits so there can be a lot more reuse there. It is often the villains that require more original sculpting.
Fwooshnet: So perhaps taking someone like Nightwing and designing a muscular, but much slimmer body-type build then having the ability to reuse a lot of parts for characters like say, the Flash or the Blue Beetle on down the line?
CB: Exactly. Somebody like Robin who has a younger, teenage body that is thinner and even smaller than Nightwing has a sculpt that can be reused for someone like Beast Boy or the Legion of Superheroes if you want to do the younger versions of them and even a lot of the other, younger Teen Titan males. That is exactly where we are trying to go. So if you notice, we also did a classic version of Red Tornado that only uses a few new parts aside from the regular release modern Red Tornado. So then you have a completely different figure, and while it is the same character, it makes for a viable variant with very few new parts. Mattel loves that, they think it is a great idea.
Fwooshnet: Firestorm is the same way.
CB: Right, Firestorm, who has not been officially announced yet, but every one could tell at the panel who he was, we did a classic and a modern version. All we had to do is switch out a few pieces, do some new paint details and we have a completely different character.
Fwooshnet: And that helps build the line’s depth and character diversity even faster.
CB: Absolutely.
CD: And it doesn’t just happen within one wave of figures. There is a lot of planning ahead to future waves when you just need a few part swaps and a new head and you can have a new character.
CB: RIght, it really is about looking ahead. While you are working on a certain figure you are thinking "how can I use this torso or this piece for another character on down the line". For instance, using the classic Red Tornado boot cuffs there are a myriad of characters that those can be used for.
Fwooshnet: Absolutely.
CD: It is kind of like a little chess game, putting pieces here and there.
CB: Yeah, Mattel sends us emails with these big Excel files with inventories saying use this piece here, that piece there and they have everything very technically lined out.
CD: It can be really mind boggling (laughs).
CB: Most of that stuff we are completely confused by (laughs).
CD: It’s funny though because you have the creative side on our part of it, then Mattel’s very clerical and money conscious approach. But often times, the way they think about it, with all these different graphs and different colors and arrows that circle around everywhere, it is all interconnected and it can be very, well, let’s keep it at mind boggling (laughs).
CB: We are often times: just send us pictures!
CD: A lot of times we just end up re-doing the whole thing anyway and probably end up saving them money anyway because of the design and the reuse that we think works well. Then we just have to end up showing them exactly what parts to use and how to do it. Then they are like "Oh! Alright, yeah, that does work!".
Fwooshnet: It is interesting to hear the marriage of Mattel’s bottom line strategy and your creative side. It all works together.
CB: It has to. We want to bring the best figures to the fans but they have to be able to make back the money they put into the new license.
Fwooshnet: So to kind of sum up the future of your DC work, what is your ultimate hope for the DC Universe Classics line? Is it anything short of doing anyone and everyone?
CB: Well someone brought it up, and yeah we want to do everybody in the DC universe-
CD: It is going to be keeping us busy for the next several years!
CB: Yeah, and somebody also brought up things like playsets and vehicles and hopefully it will become popular enough that we can start to do stuff like that. I mean, we had talked about earlier on, doing a full sized Brainiac ship that was going to be three feet tall that would have things coming out of it to hold characters so there could be battle scenes and stuff. However, right now in the early fledgeling stages of it that is probably a little to much to jump into right away. We’ll see how it goes and then we will bring it back up to Mattel in a couple of months.
Fwooshnet: Does it help that Marvel Legends, a line with a similar execution has been done before and has had a successful run and formula?
CB: Somewhat. The biggest problem with that is that with Marvel Legends, a company like Toy Biz could take a lot more risks because they did not have the overhead to consider like Mattel. But now with ML going to Hasbro, a company more similar to Mattel, they are starting to do more themed waves and things like that. Larger companies like Mattel and Hasbro just aren’t able to take those kinds of risks without having a proven model saying that they can still make their overhead. But I think that the way Mattel is doing it, they are taking small risks right now and we are going to see how the first five waves do with what we have planned out, and there are some pretty obscure characters in there, but we’ll see how they do. Then if it does as well as we think it is going to do, I think the sky is the limit. I think you are going to see people like Ambush Bug and maybe even some weird and offbeat guys like maybe the Unknown Soldier and other strange DC characters. You never know.
Fwooshnet: Yeah, since DC doesn’t want Lobo at mass market retail he would make a great exclusive for Comic Con next year.
CB: We have been pushing for Lobo for a long time and I think that is the only way that he is going to be able to make it out, doing him as a retail or con exclusive. I think that, you know, with some of the body types we’re coming up with putting together a Lobo figure would be a perfect idea. So we’ll see. Keep your fingers crossed and send letters to Mattel saying you want Lobo now.
CD: They are not kidding when they say that either. They are listening and they want to hear what the fans have to say.
CB: Even when they don’t directly respond to the question, and we weren’t really able to say this truthfully for the past few years but now, trust us, they ARE listening to what the fans are saying. They are really looking into what the fans want to see and how to work it into the line and aim it toward the fan base and not just the kids anymore. And we are just happy as hell about that.
Fwooshnet: So are you at all feeling overwhelmed with all of the stuff that you are working on right now? You are working on other things as well, are you feeling the crunch?
CD: I would not say overwhelmed. You basically have five waves a year with five figures but we could actually take on more.
CB: We do have a lot, but we have had a lot of work before. It’s not like we are not used to it, we have pillows and blankets at the studio for a reason.
Join us for the final portion of our interview the Cornboy and Chris where we wrap up our DC talk and delve into the exciting world of The Seventh Kingdom. Coming soon!
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